As the much awaited Pakistan-India talk takes place today, Wusatullah Khan asks the following:
Are Pakistan and India like Tom and Jerry – they can’t bear to be with each other yet can’t stand to be without each other either? Instead of being worried about their future, both countries are more worried about maintaining their false pride. Why are these 63-year-old countries acting like five or six-year-old school children who get into useless banter over every issue? How long will it take for them to stop this bickering?
Do you have any idea or suggestion?
Kya Pakistan or India Tom and Jerry hain – jinhain aik doosray kay saath bhi sakoon nahi or aik doosray kay bina bhi chen nahi? Donon ko apnay mustaqbal say zyada apni apni naak kay neechi ya oonchi honay ki fiqar hi kyun rehthi hai? Yeh donon 63 saala mumaalik, paanch chhay baras kay school janay walay bachon ki tarha, har maslay par guthm guhtha honay ki aadath say kab jaan churra sakain gay? Aaj bath ho gee iss par.
Aap kay zehn may bhi yaqeenan koi bath, koi sawaal ya koi tajweez ho gee. Iss kay liyeh humain likhiyeh.
Watch Wusatullah Khan live on DawnNews at 10:00 pm.
In my lifetime of 38 years, I’ve seen Indian attitude towards Pakistan change. There is only so long that people can hold up a grudge but I have been surprised with this one religious divide. With my average knowledge of history, I have not been able to understand the Hindu-Muslim hatred – its pervasive and it defies the passage of time. I can see India and Sri-Lanka deciding to be a unified country but not Pakistan.
Then one day it dawned on me. Both India and Pakistan are made predominantly of people unlike you and me. Actually, the average Pakistani or the average Indian will never post on this site – since they do not own a computer and probably cant even read. Their distrust based on history runs deep and it will be a while to change that – if ever.
Acceptance wise, I think Indians are pretty accommodating of people of different religions, culture, etc. Even Hindus in India have such varied culture and differ on so many levels that acceptance is a way of life.
I digress though, the cat and mouse analogy – Tom and Jerry is far from apt. At the risk of offending the Pakistanis – I think its more like Cat and choose any small animal. India does not care what Pakistan does. In fact, Indians are more interested in seeing Pakistan succeed.
Read all 89 responses. It appears that responses from Pakistan are more acerbic. This is somewhat astonishing from the readers of Dawn which I consider to be an extremely liberal newspaper. The responses also reflect that average Indians are now quite proud of their country’s faith in secularism, democracy and growing economic strength. The Tom and Jerry does not seem to be appropriate in describing the relationship.
I just want to say one thing and I think that goes perfectly with both countries.
Grow up guys.
I agreed with you. They never be change or they dont want to change.
We Hindus don’t believe in several gods. We believe in one God only. This is misconception among many Muslim brothers. Actually we believe in one god but we give liberty to every follower of Hinduism to pray God in any of its forms. As you know Hindus believe that god is everywhere so it must be in all living and non living things. So we are praying same God as you are praying. You think God is formless. It looks to you that Hindus pray many gods.
Actually we are praying same God which you are praying but we are praying it in different forms. So to sum up I want to say that we Hindus also believe in one god but we pray him or her in different forms. I hope I would be able to clear misconception. If I have hurt anyone’s feeling during my explanation I am expressing my deep regret.
Are you saying that had Hindus really believed in many god that would have made a legitimate case for Pakistanis to hate Hindus? don’t you think irrespective of religious believe, people should love each other for simply being human? I don’t understand logic that there should be commonness among people to live together in peace why can’t people with different believes, race or political orientation, people having nothing in common shouldn’t kill each other but respect each other?
All religion is teaching peace & harmony. All religious scholars speak about this. If we go through the history, we can see maximum people killed in this world in the name of religion & god. I think a man not following any religion will get heaven (if there is god). All Scholars will be out.
Well much have been said and done between Pakistan and India but indeed they are Tom and Jerry because whenever Tom successfully catches Jerry he leaves him and the chase begins again… now everyone is intelligent enough to understand the “RELATIONSHIP” between Pakistan and India….
I don’t agree with the author that India and Pakistan is playing Tom and Jerry games. I feel India has more or less detached from Pakistan by capitalizing on globalization. While Pakistan has been left behind in the globalization race. Feeling left out, Pakistan is trying some way or the other to attract everyone’s attention by harping on the issue of Kashmir and India. More Pakistan is fixated with India, more irrelevant it is going to look in the eyes of the international community. Its time, Pak realizes this and starts thinking independently.
India and Pakistan have never, in history, been ‘one’ country. None of the languages of Pakistan are spoken in India. The people of the land that is now called Pakistan were never Hindu in history, the vast majority of people. This is easily proven by resource to ancient Buddhist documents and the firs Arabic treatise on the region in the 7th century.
Indian have been successful in confusing their own people and Pakistanis. Moreover, Pakistan, too, needs to honestly express its own unique history.
With all these natural differences, this still does not imply both Pakistan and India cannot be on a mutually respectful relationship. India does not want it, at the official level. They have delusions of grandeur at the moment and view Pakistan as its major thorn preventing it access to Central Asia and the Middle East. In all honesty, India, as the larger power and region is behaving irresponsibly, aggravating tensions and is not sincere in resolving the Kashmir dispute as per the wishes of Kashmiri people.
Indians have a tendency to live in a state of denial. They are unwilling to concede that someone doesn’t want them, like Pakistanis, even with the global hoopla over their potential super-power status.
Ghazi
lol… Its a bit harsh.
Ghazi saheb, junoon se baatein to hum bhi kar sakte hain. What bold statements you have written! Kindly allow me to present my rebuttal.
1. Of course India and Pakistan have never been ‘one’ country.
From thousands of year before Christ till 1947 it was a nation called Bharat or Hindustan. Pakistan with all due respect was carved out of India in 1947
2. None of the languages of Pakistan are spoken in India.
Ghazi saheb, Punjabi, Sindhi, Urdu, Dogri are official languages in India
3. People of the land were not Hindu
Yes, you are partly correct because those bordering Persia were Zoroastrians (the religion that Parsis follow in Karachi today); those closer to India were either Buddhists or Hindu. The chronological order of major religions is Hinduism, Judaism, Zoroastrianism (almost extinct), Buddhism, Shintoism, Taoism, Islam, & Sikhism.
4. India does not confuse its own people. The people nation which is almost 6,000 years old do not listen to propaganda of its current regime; time is on their side. Politicians come and go, Emperors and Kings have faded. Conquerors from the times of Alexander the Great, to Genghis Khan, to Turks, Arabs, Persians, Afghans, Uzbeks, Portuguese, French and English have temporarily succeeded and influenced Bharat; yes indeed, added great flavour to it, but in the end it has prevailed. No one has succeeded in obliterating its culture and religion.
Let Pakistan succeed as a nation for at least a 1,000 years and then let our descendants revisit this issue, in a factual, logical, non-emotional manner.
Apurva: Facts are on your side. The reason India and Pakistan will have problems ( now and the future) is because Pakistan is defined as ‘Not India.’ Religion is not a determinant of people, genes are. So Pakistan has to figure out how it is different and current definitional problems lead to conflict. I may choose to be an atheist, Muslim, Hindu or Buddhist ( or all of them in a given week). But I cannot change my gene pool. Which is why Pakistanis, an aggregation of Punjabis, Sindhis, Mohajirs have great commonality with Indian Punjabis, Sindhis and others. Granted that the Baluch and Pashtun are different. So welcome to centuries of conflict as Pakistan tries to be ‘Not India’.
Ghazi,
Your Information is incorrect
People of Sindh and Pakistan were Hindus before the last Hindu King Raja Dahir was murdered by Muhammad bin Qasim
The line that divded the Vedic culture from the non Vedic culture is the Indus river
The people living beyond the Indus river(i.e. Balochistan) were not Hindus
But people living before the Indus river (Sindh,Punjab) were Hindus.
Yes,Information is incorrect
If I were the prime minister of India, I’d let Kashmiris decide for themselves. Do you want to be a part of the success story that India is? Or be a separate country that nobody outside the region can find on a map? Or do you want to be a part of sometimes democratic sometimes dictatorship always troubled Pakistan?
For this to happen (to let Kashmiris decide for themselves), Let all the Kashmiri Pundits return to their homes.
Pakistanis maintain that the core problem is solving the Kashmir issue. That Kashmir should be handed to Pakistan because the majority of Kashmiri’s are Muslims and there wish should be taken into account. The Indians say that there are more Muslims in the whole of India then there are in Pakistan and what about their wish. Also what will be their status in India should a Muslim majority state be allowed to separate. Wouldn’t they become stateless if this separation comes about?
So the Indians and Pakistanis need to realize that this is a complex issue that needs a complex solution. Hence both sides should normalize relations and as friends evolve a solution that does justice to all parties. Best wishes from Australia.
Well Pakistan needs focus on developing itself. You cannot grow big by holding others back. India is on a path of growth, progress and power. Wake up Pakistan you are going deeper in black hole. Feel sorry for you guys!
I agree 100% with Umair that the basic premise that we are two SEPERATE Nations has to be respected and maintained. However we should allow unrestricted (modified monitoring may be initially enforced) travel and trade even at the lowest level – if a “halwai in Amritsar wants to sell ladoos in Lahore – there should be no restrictions. A few years of unrestricted travel and trade will automatically flush religious bigots on both sides, besides those who sell multi billion dollars /pounds /roubles weapon systems to both sides will also loose.
This will not happen.. Generally growing countries want to join with only other developing country. It is not the case in Pakistan. This country has more illiterates who can be easily brainwashed by madarassas. There is no meaning to allow business from across the border as India will loose more than gaining. It does not need business from Pakistan as it has no potential. Just because being weak economically.
Pakistan and India are not Tom and Jerry. They two countries and majority of masses are ideologically very different. Having belief in one God and in Several Gods is just one simple example.
Unfortunately Shiraz you know very little about Hinduism.
It is the only religion in the world which talks of “vasudaiva kutumbakam”- that is the whole world is my family.
This is also the reason that Hindus may worship 33000 gods and goddesses but you will never see sectarian hatred.
Just for your understanding- there is one God in Hinduism ( in the sense of the supreme creator). What you confuse as Gods are Avatars- people with great moral authority who helped people fight evil.
Shiraz,
Let the people of this world decide weather God is one or many.
The presence of so many religions around the world(Atleast 100 religions I know apart from 4-5 major ones) itself is a testimony that there can be more than one God.
Dear Karuna,
There are major 3 religions in the world Christianity, Judaism, and Islam. They all believe in theism, meaning, there’s only one God, who created the universe, sun, stars and the earth we live. Hinduism is the oldest religion in the world. There was Hinduism in Saudi Arabia before Prophet Muhammad, who later destroyed all of them and educated people about monotheism. Now, if you talk to religious scholars of any religion, they will tell you that it has to be one God because if there is more than one God they will conflict with each other. The conflict takes place no matter what, however, if there is one God there is no conflict with anyone. In this world Christianity is the number One religion population wise, there are more Christians living in this world than any other religion followed by Islam that is the second largest religion in the world. I am not bashing Islam here or preaching Christianity. I am only stating facts that there must be something about these religions that draws more and more people towards itself. Islam is by far the fastest growing religion in the west, including United States. Make no mistake Christianity is also part of Islamic believe system so is Judaism. Islam is the only religion may be some Judaism that confirms and verifies that Jesus was born from virgin marry out of God’s will.
Choudhary: if Hindus have several Gods (and that is a misunderstanding, but deal with it later), what is it to you? You mind your house and we mind our house. Unlike Pakistan, India and Indians do not want to live in a time warp. We want to progress, develop, rather than debate what our neighbour’s beliefs are.
Now, since you say that “there must be something about these religions (Islam, Christianity, Judiasm) that draws more and more people towards itself” then you should also ponder over the fact that Hinduism is an older religion than Islam, Christianity and Judaism and still practiced by billions. This is despite 400 years of Mughal rule and 150 years of Christian (British rule). By your own logic, there must be something about Hinduism that makes it the oldest surviving religion.
yes there is one difference between Hinduism and the other religions you mentioned.
hinduism does not convert.
there are 930 million Hindus in the world today despite that.
820m live in India,
the rest are in Guyana, Mauritius, lanka, malaysia, Bangladesh, fiji, UK, USA, Canada etc.
Dear Shiraz sir,
You know little about Indians. They don’t care about gods any more, mostly, there is no one god or several gods. FYI where was/were god(s) when Dinosaurs were roaming the very earth, in India or Pakistan? It’s funny. However I believe in love and don’t say its god gifted.
Best Wishes.
If what’s done, can’t be undone, then why can’t we have a “Federation of Nations” of Pakistan, India and Bangladesh? We can very well thrive on our common, yet diverse and rich cultural heritage.
The example of family brothers getting separated yet, maintaining and enjoying family ties is very well suited. Also, with the advent of internet and global closeness, people are now coming out of shells. Similar to “Doctors without borders”, we can unite as “Citizens without borders” for sharing what’s worth sharing-love and not hatred. Manipulations by politicians will then be totally meaningless.
Very well said.
Very truly said. I totally acknowledge your views Mr. Romesh peace is the order of the day, the only way we can move ahead. 60 years of deep seated hatred has harmed us alot and damage has been immense people of both sides being the sufferers. But I still think, things can be resurrected and the harmony can be brought back many constraints notwithstanding and which will only see both countries benefiting from each others. Let us kill the demons inside us and love each other. Let us not allow those orthodox forces to dictate us and to be a hindrance in the peace process. The tomorrow will be ours then.
Pakistan and other islamic countries are based on ideology of “country for muslims only”.Countries that start their names with “Islamic” Republic of XYZ are classic example of religious discrimination against people who are citizens of that country but are non-muslim.
If muslims are unfair to other religions then other religions WILL be unfair to them.Entire non-muslims in world have started to realise this fact and thats why muslims are getting discriminated .
If muslims wants world to be fair with them then they will need to be fair to world.
Pakistan was made in the name of Islam ! and secondly 98 % of the total population are Muslims so doesn’t make any difference. And the way non Muslims enjoy liberty in Pakistan I think no where else in the world.
@Faraz: Non-muslim enjoy liberty in Pakistan!!
Really, pal? Define Liberty.
All the Minority live a peaceful life in Pakistan. There are many trouble for Minorities in Australia, England, France e.t.c? Especially with Muslims. Muslim are peaceful nation in world but named as terrorist. All people have right to Live A Peaceful Life !!!! are you Not ??
Again- Muslims are not a nation. Islam is a religion. There is a huge difference between a Kosovar Muslim and an Afghan Muslim. For example, there is very little in common between a Nigerian Anglican and a British Anglican.
There should have been no division. Agreed.
But a division done should never be undone.
There are divisions in family too. Brothers start living separately. But they remain brothers. They keep meeting. They attend weddings in each others family. They live separately. But when one brother is threatened by a third party, the brothers come together and face the threat jointly. That is how it can and should be between the brothers that India and Pakistan are.
We need to change our mentality with respect to both side and nothing.
Once we fight then we understand. We have same thinking, because both country leaders don’t want to resolve their real issue. If dispute is going to be resolved then what will they do.
Independence for both the countries was wrong in the first place and totally premature.
You are right because no country can be formed on the basis of religion.
Countries reflect cultures and civilization.
Some people here are talking that India and Pakistan should become one..
We are two different nations and can’t we just respect this and move ahead with our lives.
Saying that India and Pakistan should become same is just like saying that Bangladesh should again be made part of Pakistan which is wrong in my opinion.I wonder how these people will react if some leader suggest this..We should move forward not backward.
Please stop saying this that once again that India and Pakistan should be one again. Pakistan is a sovereign state and let it be like that. No point in trying to go back again and again. Let us wish them well and let them progress and learn from their own mistakes and let us learn from ours. We are two different nations with now different identities.
Constitutionally we are secular and they are an Islamic country and it is their choice. If they did not listen or follow the what road map the founder laid down it is their problem to solve it or sleep over it.
India has to look after its own interests and so also Pakistan. Is we can co operate, well and good- if not than maybe not put hurdles across each others path- if even that is not possible than let each manage their own affairs the way it wants. No whining and pining from either side.
It would look good to visitors on both sides of the border.
Can we start with small things in Life which could be achievable.
Thanks to all.
What a shame religion has divided a Power full country .
What a shame divided own people are fighting with each other.
Its just 63 years of division , we can be one.
Of course we can be one again. Pakistan is built on a false premise. Its only logical that India will be united once again.
We cant be one nation now. Its too difficult to happen. But yes we can be just free and borderless like US and Canada ..
India have a history that whenever they start losing grounds against Pakistan on some issue they shout for brotherhood and equality and find help from the world but when they have upper hand on any issue they don’t care about Pakistan.
There were reasons behind creation of Pakistan.
If you look closely Pakistan never complain or interfere India as long as they work in their own domain.
Take example of IPL (I am giving this example because I think 90% of the people would easily relate to it) what if the league was PPL and upon announcing the names of Tendulkar, Dhoni and Sehwag all of the franchise remained silent.
What would you think be the stance of the Indians, their newspaper and their govt against us?????
My whole point is Pakistan rarely interfere but India always does because they don’t want us to progress and prove the point that the separation was a mistake.
First I mention that India never lose any ground against Pakistan, only matter is the time 40 years ago we do not like to talk each other but now it is possible after 40 years may be possible that we walk together so my dear neighbor just wait for passing time hope for best till than enjoy movement.
Our problems can be solved if we unified Pak and Ind, I mean India (before 1947), I think it is possible.
When We we talk about Ind and Pak we think about Hindu and Muslims.
Please remove religion we can be one.
To remove religion we should remove religious hardliners.
True. People keep getting confused between God and Religion.
Pakistan is more concerned about India than India is about Pakistan.
From your comment it seems like you writing from India. IF true, than what are you doing on a Pakistani news website? doesn’t it show that Indians are more interested in Pakistan and its happenings?
We are very interested in Pakistan. What is wrong with that? China is very interested in Taiwan for the same reason.
Okay, the reason Indians come to Pakistani news websites it to gain some knowledge about thinking of Pakistanis. More often than not, the news papers in Pakistan, and reputed ones like Dawn reflect government and public thinking. It is different in India where news papers like Time of India often misread people’s mind.